Elder J. Golden Pittakos wrote:

And who is going to pay for the schools that it will take to house another 155,000 projected students in our public education system? If you can get 155,000 kids on vouchers for a couple of thousand, it seems to me that you would not only save the taxpayers the costs of building all those new schools but also the majority of the costs of educating them. This is the one aspect that the anti-voucher crowd is ignoring. Schools will not lose any money because growth will most likely keep pace with the losses. If the mega-millionaires (Huntsman, Eyres, etc)of the State can figure that out, then who should we trust? Those who know how to make and save money or those who spend it?


Who's going to pay for it? We all are of course. And it won't be any more of a problem than building schools for our children has been in the past.

The 155000 increase in students is projected to cost $20000 per student for new schools, or a total of $3.1 billion. This is the pro-voucher number being thrown around that is supposed to scare people :o into voting for vouchers.

Well, here's the not so scary truth about that number. We will have an average of about 1 million tax paying households to pay that $3.1 billion bill. That's only $3100 per household. Spread that out over the 20 year life of a school bond and it's only an average increase of $155/year. Spread it out over the 50 year life of a school and it's only $62/year. Furthermore, this doesn't include increases in corporate property tax revenue, so the actual amount will be even less.

BTW, Pitt, just how do you suppose 155000 students will be convinced to switch under this voucher program? The Legislature's own analysis is estimating less than 2500 switchers during the first year. The simple truth is that there is not enough demand, and the voucher is not near enough incentive, to convince anywhere near enough students to switch just for the program to break even once it is fully implemented.

cache wrote:

leftintheuc wrote:

unaffiliated_person wrote:

With a 2000 voucher, it would cost about 2-3000 dollars out of pocket to attend a private school with many of their tuition rates.


This is my point: This is still at least a couple hundred bucks per month per child.


It depends on the private school. I was surprised to see how many private schools there are in Utah whose tuition would be completely covered by a voucher:

http://affordableprivateschools.com/bystate.aspx?state=UT


There is a lot of incomplete information there. If you un-click religious it still lists the American Heritage Schools (LDS). The majority of the non-sectarian institutions seem quite a bit more expensive. It appears that vouchers will mostly be useful for religious schools which seems to go against the Utah constitution (if not the US).

cache wrote:

leftintheuc wrote:

unaffiliated_person wrote:

With a 2000 voucher, it would cost about 2-3000 dollars out of pocket to attend a private school with many of their tuition rates.


This is my point: This is still at least a couple hundred bucks per month per child.


It depends on the private school. I was surprised to see how many private schools there are in Utah whose tuition would be completely covered by a voucher:

http://affordableprivateschools.com/bystate.aspx?state=UT


Look at the details. Many of those schools will not qualify for the voucher program. Furthermore, many of them probably won't accept the vouchers as well.

In Salt Lake County, there is one school (St. John the Baptist) for 1st through 6th graders that is under $4000 and currently meets the minimum requirements for voucher schools, at least with the data the website has available. It's pretty clear to me that this website is nothing but a propaganda tool set up to try to deflect criticism about the lack of availability for low cost private schools.

Hammer wrote:

earljr wrote:

Hammer wrote:

Also, for those of you middle-classers like me; if the voucher system is passed, it will cost you. Taxes will be raised. On a $200,000 house, your property taxes will increase $100/year, every year, for at least the next 20 years. And of course that goes up if you have a nicer house than me.


Of course even the anti voucher people will admit that you totally made this up. There is no property tax increase even possible as a result of vouchers. Vouchers are not funded by property taxes. Please post your sources.

As for this inane letter, I know a truck load of people who will be able afford private school with the help of vouchers. None of them rich. Some poor. I personally home school, so we are not eligible for vouchers even if we wanted to go to private school. However, we could easily afford private school at American Heritage with vouchers. We could not possibly afford it without the vouchers. You guys are liars and despise the poor as much as you despise the rich.


It's from a blog about the Wisconsin try at vouchers. They say it didn't work. Competition didn't fix the schools. And property taxes constantly increased to pay for it. Source is againstutahvouchers.blogspot.com


There is no proposal to raise property taxes by $100 on a $200k house to pay for vouchers. Vouchers are paid for out of the state's general fund. This is not funded by property taxes. Therefore this is a complete fabrication intended to trick foolish people.

However, there is a $1,700 property tax on a $350k house to pay for schools in the A.S.D. This is a $400 increase over last year. The school district will be happy to increase that even further at any opportunity. And you will suddenly be in favor of higher taxes.

Your claim about Wisconsin is also a fabrication.

earljr wrote:

Hammer wrote:

earljr wrote:

Hammer wrote:

Also, for those of you middle-classers like me; if the voucher system is passed, it will cost you. Taxes will be raised. On a $200,000 house, your property taxes will increase $100/year, every year, for at least the next 20 years. And of course that goes up if you have a nicer house than me.


Of course even the anti voucher people will admit that you totally made this up. There is no property tax increase even possible as a result of vouchers. Vouchers are not funded by property taxes. Please post your sources.

As for this inane letter, I know a truck load of people who will be able afford private school with the help of vouchers. None of them rich. Some poor. I personally home school, so we are not eligible for vouchers even if we wanted to go to private school. However, we could easily afford private school at American Heritage with vouchers. We could not possibly afford it without the vouchers. You guys are liars and despise the poor as much as you despise the rich.


It's from a blog about the Wisconsin try at vouchers. They say it didn't work. Competition didn't fix the schools. And property taxes constantly increased to pay for it. Source is againstutahvouchers.blogspot.com


There is no proposal to raise property taxes by $100 on a $200k house to pay for vouchers. Vouchers are paid for out of the state's general fund. This is not funded by property taxes. Therefore this is a complete fabrication intended to trick foolish people.

However, there is a $1,700 property tax on a $350k house to pay for schools in the A.S.D. This is a $400 increase over last year. The school district will be happy to increase that even further at any opportunity. And you will suddenly be in favor of higher taxes.

Your claim about Wisconsin is also a fabrication.


Well who's fabricating it then smart guy? Just where should I go to get information?