Thanks again for taking your valuable time to comment. You're not going out on a limb at all. I'm not going to attack for your comments.

Since I started with this post, I've put up my personal experience for public comment. I'm usually too nervous to call a radio show to express my opinion. I've never in my life written a letter to the editor of any paper. I'm 52. So it took a lot to be here at all.

This whole situation has been so bewildering and frustrating. I struggle to make sense of any of it.

I readily admit, I felt more at peace and safer in the Church than I have outside it. On the other hand, when the Church, with all it's rules and commandments comes in conflict with my integrity, I have to go with my integrity.

This consumes my thinking these days.

I used to believe that as a dad, I was a servant to my children and my wife. It was a gift to have children and being a creative guy, I could think of some really wildly fun and meaningful experiences for my family. I was parenting with "intention". To teach about service, I used to take my kids, set them on my lap while I was donating blood. Today, we're a one family blood drive. I didn't have grandparents but I somehow knew that grandparents could be of value so I gave my in-laws carte blanch with the grandkids.
I deliberately didn't take a job that would have me travel so I could be home with my kids.

So to get to the end and be left out seems so bizarre. I guess in my stupid thinking I thought surely my wife and my kids would choose me...something would happen...and they didn't.
It was like getting hit with that Gator-Aid bucket of ice they hit the coach with at the end of the football game. And all these people, I'd known for years...surely they'd all turn and say, "he's the dad, he if anyone deserves to be here."
That didn't happen either.

And that's part of why I think religion falls short.

I saw a picture of the pope this morning in the NY Times. He gave a mass to 60,000 people. There wasn't enough room for all the people that wanted to see him. Wolf Blitzer was given a chance to meet the Pope and was falling all over himself, excited. I don't get it. The prophets and apostles all have that kind of celebrity status.

When my second daughter was married, my other married daughter and her husband drove me to the Temple. As we were circling the Temple, we were in front of the Ch office buildings and had to stop for some pedestrians. My son-in-law was figuratively speaking almost wetting himself excited because a general authority was in the crosswalk...at least he thought it was...but he couldn't remember just who.

I'm here for all the personal growth I can get and all the magical experiences I can create.

I have learned so much being on this. Someone made a comment that perhaps I was trying to make my children miserable just because I was so angry. So I went out and wrote out a letter to my daughter apologizing if that's how I've shown up as a father. It happens to be her birthday this week so I sent her a care package...with a dvd, and popcorn and balloons and Skittles and a card and this letter from her dad.

Then I surprised my 15 year old son, picked him up out of school for a "lunch with dad". It occurred to me I've been doing that with all my kids. I asked my son if he felt like I was in anyway trying to beat him up with my expectations. The whole time was full of teasing and joking with each other...he's almost as tall as I am. With a head full of almost white hair, he was joking with me as if I was needing help across the street.

So now I'm thinking about, why I should be so angry and upset...hey it's an hour ceremony. Why not focus on all the good stuff? I'm going to do more of that.

I've heard over and over, my whole life, that if you aren't going to do anything about something, there's no use in complaining. Maybe something good will happen.

Maybe with my posts here, the next time you or others attend a temple wedding, you'll notice a mother or father, or a grandfather or grandmother who had the courage to show up at all in spite of the hurt, sitting on the bench outside the Temple, and maybe you'll have a little more compassion realizing disappointment they might feel.

Or maybe some will agree with me, and think nothing should get in the way of parents and their kids. Someone sets up a rule...a government sets up a law...and in short order, it becomes part of the culture that no one questions. What does it say about people who put more weight on a ceremony, over a 20 year relationship? And maybe have some courage to challenge this. Change has happened before in the LDS Church.

Polygamy...blacks and the priesthood...baptism for the dead of deceased Jewish Holocaust victims.. there have been changes in the past...why not now?

With all these changes that have occurred how do you decide what is "sacred"?

You said,

"It sounds to me that you want to take away this sacred ceremony from the LDS people in your life because you feel that your parental relationship should be more important than their religious beliefs because you don't happen to believe in what they believe."

To clarify, I'm saying "our" parental relationships...not just mine. Yours too and every family on this planet. The bible talks about honouring your father and your mother...(my opinion) I'm saying that marriage and the relationship of parents to their children is what's real and is what is sacred...leaving them out does not honour them in any way.

Someone suggested that "hurt feelings" is not going to be a good reason for not following the rules. I'd say that if "following the rules" is causing a lot of people (people seem to forget this here--if with every temple wedding even 1 close family member is disappointed, the Church with this rule is routinely disappointing tens of thousands of people every year)why not adjust the rules to include everyone. Have them wear white. Give them a short lesson on how to behave in the Temple booklet.

Why should anyone have to jump hoops to participate in a family experience as basic as marriage?

(My opinion) No one...not the Church...not the government...not the neighbours or other people have any right to get between loving family members.

I got the expression, "emotional extortion" from Dr. Phil, who I never watch. There was a son and his family who were living in a house owned by his mother. He wasn't paying the rent, and it was causing the mom some hardship. So every time she'd suggest he had to move out, he'd hold the kids as hostage or tell her that it was her fault if her grandchildren were left out.

He was manipulating her with the kids.

In this situation, those in the Church have all these rules to follow to be able to see their children's weddings. Those outside the Church would have to join the Church to see their children get married. To me that's not right for either of us. And yet those in the Church will never challenge or criticize their leaders because they're taught not to. From a now outsiders perspective it seeming to be more and more like control.

I think I've beat this horse to death.

My request to you...next time at a Temple wedding...look around and notice.

You sound very weary in your last post, LifeRocks. Unhappiness drains the spirit and body. We've all been there. Truly, I see your point of view and I'm sure you see ours; we just don't agree. You refer to the "rules" of the Church. . .A rule to me implies strictness. The Church/gospel doesn't have rules; we have commandments, principles, doctrine, guidelines, etc. But until anyone gains a testimony of these commandments, etc., and then keeps that testimony healthy, yes, these will always be rules.

And, yes, we do question the gospel, at least I have during my lifelong membership in the Church. I've studied and prayed a lot, remembering not to counsel Heavenly Father by telling Him what "I" want Him to do, what I want Him to fix, what I want Him to change. I think you're selling your testimony short, LifeRocks. You had one at one time. Think of this. . .You said you were very disappointed and hurt when your children didn't choose you. You're Heavenly Father's child, and you didn't choose Him.

Again, to start, let me thank you for taking time out of your life to respond whether we agree or not.

There's no easy answer here.

Those in any religious organization that hold so tenaciously onto their beliefs leave little room for compromise.

As for not choosing Heavenly Father, there are many in other faiths who think I have by leaving.
I know you don't see it that way.

I don't think being a member of a Church makes you a good disciple any more than being born in this country makes you a good citizen.

For all the hard stuff I've experienced, I've had some miracles occur that would not have happened had I stayed.

So I guess everyone has to do what they feel is right for them.

And again, I thank you for your time and thoughtful reply.

Life Rocks wrote:
Again, to start, let me thank you for taking time out of your life to respond whether we agree or not.

There's no easy answer here.

Those in any religious organization that hold so tenaciously onto their beliefs leave little room for compromise.

As for not choosing Heavenly Father, there are many in other faiths who think I have by leaving.
I know you don't see it that way.

I don't think being a member of a Church makes you a good disciple any more than being born in this country makes you a good citizen.

For all the hard stuff I've experienced, I've had some miracles occur that would not have happened had I stayed.

So I guess everyone has to do what they feel is right for them.

And again, I thank you for your time and thoughtful reply.

And how many mircles would have there been had you stayed, and watched your kids in the temple, go with them, still have your family and the priesthood to bless there lives?

Sure being a member of any religion doesn't make you a saint, not sure what your point is except to kinda bash the church with little innuendo's you like to throw out in congnito. I would imagine this comes out to your kids also, and they get tired of it, think about it.

Life Rocks, I`ve been reading these posts for a couple of days, and thought that I would respond. It sounds like a tough situation, and I don`t envy your position. In the end, all you can do is still support your daughter, and let her know that you love her.

There is no doctrinal reason why church should make a couple wait for one year, after a civil marriage, before having a temple marriage. In Europe the govt. doesn`t recognize a church marriage. The couple goes to city hall in the morning, gets married in a civil ceremony, and that afternoon goes to the temple for the "sealing." I expect that if you had the same situation in the states, the church would have a similar policy.

I think the whole temple thing is just a tool for control. Eternal marriage, "families can be together forever," posthumously baptising relatives etc., is quite a hook the church has to keep people obedient. I mean who wouldn`t want to be with their family forever? I suppose that there are some, but I would guess the majority of people would want to be together in the eternities. I think this tool is quite effective in practise, but it does, in some situations, drive a wedge between family members.

Continue to love and support your daughter, and try not to let this damage your relationship. Just my 2 pence.

Dubbs wrote:
Life Rocks wrote:
Again, to start, let me thank you for taking time out of your life to respond whether we agree or not.

There's no easy answer here.

Those in any religious organization that hold so tenaciously onto their beliefs leave little room for compromise.

As for not choosing Heavenly Father, there are many in other faiths who think I have by leaving.
I know you don't see it that way.

I don't think being a member of a Church makes you a good disciple any more than being born in this country makes you a good citizen.

For all the hard stuff I've experienced, I've had some miracles occur that would not have happened had I stayed.

So I guess everyone has to do what they feel is right for them.

And again, I thank you for your time and thoughtful reply.

And how many mircles would have there been had you stayed, and watched your kids in the temple, go with them, still have your family and the priesthood to bless there lives?

Sure being a member of any religion doesn't make you a saint, not sure what your point is except to kinda bash the church with little innuendo's you like to throw out in congnito. I would imagine this comes out to your kids also, and they get tired of it, think about it.

Think about it? Dumbya asking someone to think about it? Ha ha ha ha ha.
Why don't you think about not spreading your vileness to people who are hurting, Dumbya?