BBBB wrote:
Quote:
whether in a business corporation, or a religious organization...those who constantly gripe and complain to 'management' about every last detail of the administration of the corporation or religious organization eventually either find themselves being ignored...or 'terminated'.

I do not blame anyone. If I were on their positions, I perhaps did the same thing. That is an organization, but that is not the Gospel in order to develop the members. That is to run a business or an enterprise, but that is not to develop the members. Perhaps, I ran the organization the same way, if I were on their positions. However, that is not the Gospel, but only profit business.

I still do not blame anyone for running business. I just feel sorry about some members, who saw their Wards were not a good place to develop their family and children, so they attended other Wards' meetings instead of complaining and objecting the management. The consequence was and is and will be: no signature of the original Ward's bishop for their temple recommend renewal. That is one example of the above quote "being ignored".


How is helping people a business? Maybe your Bishop is trying to teach self reliance? As I have seen many members live off the church for literally 5 to 10 years in some cases, completly taking advantage of it.

Then when a new Bishop looked at the situation and told one man that he had to go find a job and start working, the man went inactive.

Dubbs wrote:
Jaye wrote:

Are you going to try to claim that you and your wife have NEVER watched an R rated movie?


When we were married we promised each other we would follow the PRophets council,



Answer the question with a yes or no, Dubbs.

Have you and your wife seen an R rated movie?

Dubbs wrote:
Jaye wrote:
[
1. The condo is given to them for as long as they live.

2. I wouldn't consider a condo worth $1.2 MILLION dollars in SLC to be a modest little cottage either..


The condo is "Given to them" or is it used as an office for their work and home?


You understand the difference right?


You don't seem to understand that it's not "given" to them as an assest they can sell, pass along to relatives right?


As I said you love to twist things to make the brethen look bad, just another example.

You are mischaracterizing, Dubbs.

The "condo" etc is remuneration for their work. Yes, it is compensation.

Yes, it makes them a paid priesthood.

Dubbs wrote:
Jaye wrote:
Dubss said..."I think you have an odd obession with thinking people are money minded, maybe there just like you and just are trying there best, and your judging them harshly?"

Interesting. You have been obsessed with John's financial circumstances for quite a while. Maybe he's just like you, and he's trying his best, and you're judging HIM harshly.

Or with BBBB...you have been making quite a few remarks about his communication skills, and his grasp of English.

Perhaps he's just like you Dubss. He's a man, just like you. He has his likes and his dislikes, just like you. He is a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, just like you.

The only difference I see is that BBBB is not star-struck, as you are, and he is capable of seeing that in HIS neck of the woods, the Church is not living up to their responsibilities to the membership.

This is where similarity ends. You look at the Church, and you can see no wrongdoing...no errors...no mistakes in judgment or in administration.

You are a wealthy man. You claim to own several homes, and be a very young semi-retired man.

You live in a very wealthy Ward. Why WOULD you understand what BBBB is trying to convey? You have no basis for comparison.

BBBB, on the other hand, might not be so wealthy. His fellow members might not be so wealthy. It is possible that he lives in a relatively impoverished area.

It is also possible that the men who have amassed enough wealth to enable them to spend the time and effort as leaders in the faith are not doing their best to care for those who are less fortunate than they are.

My Stake is very diverse. We have people who own waterfront estates on the lakes, or on the Puget Sound...and, being a military zone, we have people living in impoverished circumstances in Section 8 housing.

We are fortunate to have some very decent men administering our Stake. They honor their calling, and take their responsibilities very seriously.

It has not always been like this though. And within the membership, even though our leaders are decent and humble men, we do have a number of members who are very lifted up in the pride of their financial circumstances.

Much as you are.


Dubss said...'Be best to try to talk with them in a one on one setting, and not bad mouth them behind their back.'

To which I reply...Now look who's talking about following the conversation.

This is exactly what BBBB has done. He started off by taking it to his ward leaders, then went to his Stake leaders, and so on and so forth.

He has not received answers to his questions, or his concerns.

You voiced doubt that he received an email from the Secretary of the Twelve telling him to quiet down.

I do not doubt it at all.

After all...the Secretary to the First Presidency took it upon himself to contact the President of the Tabernacle Choir and the LDS Orchestra and opine that they might have an enemy in their midst...(Peter Danzig).

And if a member gets too vocal in his criticism, or his questions...they WILL be contacted by the Church leadership, and told to quiet down.


blah blah hypocrite, blah blah whiner.

Dubbs can't answer logically, so he attacks the person.

Not Christian behavior at all by you, Dubbs.

Wren wrote:
Dubbs wrote:
Jaye wrote:

Are you going to try to claim that you and your wife have NEVER watched an R rated movie?


When we were married we promised each other we would follow the PRophets council,



Answer the question with a yes or no, Dubbs.

Have you and your wife seen an R rated movie?

That's what I just said dar dar.

BBBB wrote:
[When I speculated why the bishop got fired, my family firend (the new bishopric) said I was wrong.

I could be wrong... I might handle things the same way.



You should really read what your saying and take heed, you were wrong in your judgment in one case, and in others you admit you would probably do things the same way. So let them lead, without constant bickering you seem to cause.


Let them lead without your constant jugement, if you have a complaint, express it in a one on one setting with ypour Bishop, if he feels it is worthy of addressing, he will go to the stake president, who will also move it along if he finds it a pressing issue in the area.


This is the line of authority that should be used, by you going around it, not only are you making yourself look bad, and ruining your reputation, but you are usurping others priesthood authority.